There’s a lot of evidence that modern CBT therapy just doesn’t really connect with men very well. Mainly because we don’t really tend to solve problems by “considering more gratitude” or “trying yoga at sunrise maybe?” (Was a legit suggestion when I had a therapist lol.)
Edit: yoga and exercise are awesome, and physical activity can be therapy in itself for many people! There’s some truth to the trope that some men like to hit the gym to deal with their complex feelings lol.
Men tend to want practical steps and solutions to things. And there isn’t a whole lot of practical solutions one person can try to repair the effects of an increasingly alienating society and collapsing socioeconomic structures.
Therapists can be very helpful, and by all means you should definitely try to find a good one.
But sadly when you realize a lot of your issues are circumstantial and practical though, things like “Well I’m depressed and anxious because I feel everything is out of my control, like layoffs and rent hikes.”…
…Sometimes it feels like the prevalent training and methodology seems to say “Well that sounds like a you problem.”
There’s a really good podcast about this called “It’s Not Just In Your Head”
And a YouTube guy “Dr. K” (actually a doctor btw) who runs a channel called "HealthyGamerGG.
The topic is definitely worth analysis and discussion, why therapy isn’t working for men in particular, as it’s often swept under the rug as just “Men being stubborn and toxic” or whatever, but there is a lot more at play here.
We need to make sure men are heard and cared for, before they get warped by all the “alpha grind real man” grifters that understand how they work, and use it for malicious means.
EDIT: I’m really glad this seems to have started a somewhat productive discussion! I want to clarify that I’m NOT tearing down CBT or therapy or yoga or anything!
I’m merely calling attention to certain blind spots I’ve experienced (and therapists have also been discussing) when it comes to how therapy is conducted, and how it might get better in dealing with how men tend to experience the world.
Again, therapy is great and I encourage you to try it. But I’m mainly talking about why men shy away from it, and how we need to seriously talk about how to help them before they start thinking people like Andrew Tate have their best interests at heart.
Mainly because we don’t really tend to solve problems by “considering more gratitude” or “trying yoga at sunrise maybe?”
I feel like at some point all the therapists, at least Western ones, got together and decided that instead of helping men with practical advice and solutions, they would offer help that while being far less practical, would, at least hopefully, in some small way, make them feel a smidge bit better about the problems.
Will yoga at sunrise fix the issues? No. Will it help you feel better about them? That’s the hope. Because, unfortunately, a lot of issues are outside of our control, so the modern therapy approach seems to be centered on getting patients to focus more on the things within their control, like how the things outside of their control make them feel.
There’s a lot of evidence that modern CBT therapy just doesn’t really connect with men very well. Mainly because we don’t really tend to solve problems by “considering more gratitude” or “trying yoga at sunrise maybe?” (Was a legit suggestion when I had a therapist lol)
Source?
I’m asking because this sounds nothing like CBT that I did. I’m a woman, but it was gut-wrenching and scary to do exposure therapy. Nothing at all about yoga or gratitude… sounds more like traditional talk therapy to me.
I would give CBT a chance, honestly… I feel like you have some kind of misinformed opinion or maybe had a crappy therapist.
Edit: just for clarity, CBT is a type of talk therapy, but the stuff this person I’m replying to describes sounds more like traditional armchair therapist self-help-book Freudian therapy.
Maybe we have a slight misunderstanding about CBT? CBT I’m referring to is “Cognitive Behavioral Therapy”, not exposure therapy. I hope the exposure therapy was beneficial to you though. :)
Basic CBT I’m talking about is a talk therapy modality where the patient is trained to observe the cycle between their thoughts, feelings, and actions, and pay a bit more mindfulness to how they react to things.
I don’t wanna bash it! But my point is, sometimes men in particular are not raised to understand or differentiate their emotional feelings on a deep level, so this talk therapy alone doesn’t really give them something “actionable” to start solving the problem when you keep getting asked:
“So how does that make you feel?” “Bad?” “Why?”
It can be helpful and it certainly helped me! BUT alone, it also has a blind-spot where it’s not as helpful to the way men experience the world. Usually much more externally, and less “pondering feelings.”
I know I’m not articulating this the best way, there’s a lot of nuance, but I’m glad it’s started a productive discussion!
I’m merely saying it can be better, not trying to tear it down. :)
No, I’m confident about what I said. Exposure therapy is one part of CBT.
I did CBT for PTSD and death anxiety, the latter involving large bits of exposure therapy.
https://www.psychologytools.com/professional/techniques/exposure/
Do you have any evidence about men having issues with this sort of therapy or is that a personal observation?
Edit: honestly it sounds like you had a bad therapist experinece and that therapist has no idea what CBT is (and sorry to say, but neither do you particularly)
Edit: had to add the passive aggressive smiley :)
Lol funny how we seem to be carrying on different conversations in different threads. Anyway…
So first, sorry if the smilies come off as passive aggressive. I just talk like that because I’m emotive, and it helps to convey a cordial attitude on an increasingly hostile internet. _
Second, basic disclaimer, not a psychologist, sooo…
When I see papers like this, I’m inclined to believe CBT and exposure therapy are different techniques, if they’re being compared as such. But of course, the same practitioner can use different techniques and tools with the same patient.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3347982/
But hey, if I’m wrong and this source is wrong, cool. I’m happy to learn something. To be frank, semantics don’t super interest me though.
So about men in therapy, my evidence is both personal experience, and secondhand reports from psychology professionals I don’t know personally, and isn’t gonna be revolutionary and mind-blowing.
I feel like my therapy experience between two or three therapists was…ok. But I very often felt misunderstood, and like there was a fundamental misunderstanding as to what I was on about at the root of the whole thing.
So, afformentioned Dr. K has a good video about this (YouTube link, dunno how to share as Newpipe) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uf8bt6fGQyA
Found a thoughtful blog here that resonates as to the reasoning. I think he’s making sense. https://www.saltcitycounseling.com/post/why-do-men-do-so-poorly-in-therapy
And I can’t find the particular episode, but these fine folks discuss it sometimes. https://www.youtube.com/@itsnotjustinyourhead/
It’s an unpopular opinion, but people in general, even psychologists, either see no real reason to particularly understand men, or worse and more rarely, actively find them repugnant.
Hope this helps.
